Nora, Tech Witch @tindall@cybre.space

@xnx38h nothing is wrong with bindings. I've written programs with and blog posts about gtk-rs. I'm just wondering if anyone is working on this.

@icedquinn gtk-rs is not pure rust; it's bindings to GTK.

are there any pure #Rust GUI libraries targeted at the desktop? a la GTK or Qt, rather than dear imgui or like that

@cosine yes, i agree with you here. if that's what chosa was saying i definitely misunderstood them, and that's on me. thank you for taking the time and energy to set me straight on that.

@keithzg Yeah, sadly that's not in the cards

@QuietMisdreavus Yeah, that stuff is pretty cool! I should really do more with what exists on Android, but updates break thing so often it's almost not worth it.

I guess the other question raised by this discussion is: what kind of software do people want to see, delivered either on mobile or over the web, that doesn't currently exist/isn't free?

@cosine see for instance: what if we built a handheld device OS that was built around interfaces between graphical apps?

that would empower a lot of people to do a lot of things and is also hugely dis-incentivized by the funding and profit structure of proprietary software

@cosine yeah, that's fair. i guess my fundamental disagreement is that the reason it isn't useful isn't an inherent property of software, but rather a set of mostly deliberate decisions by those creating systems software to make applications software a pain in the ass to work with, and i think that's something FOSS and _only_ FOSS can solve (because everyone else has disincentives to)

@cosine yeah i mean i also wouldn't blame anyone for that, what i'm specifically commenting on is the thing that FOSS zealots do where they go into people's mentions who are talking about proprietary software and essentially harass them for not using FOSS and I think that picking on people for using free software made by bad people is essentially similar? like i think there's a difference between blocking people and telling them they have to change the software they use based on the ideology of its creators, who they _don't financially support_ in the case of free software

also i know two people who use freetusky because it doesn't crash on old android while tusky does which is the "need" i was referring to, not the ability to use Gab

@cosine oh yeah you're absolutely right lol

sorry

i... don't agree with that, really? like, the things that people want to do with their devices, especially handheld devices, really do require centralized or at least pseudocentralized services, because people pay for data and because people don't have a tolerance for latency (which isn't their fault, capitalism demands promptness)

as someone who just spent a year building a decentralized networking protocol i'm very bearish on the anything that claims low data usage and good latency, especially on platforms like iOS where the platform vendor intentionally kneecaps apps that don't want to use centralized services

@cosine but that's not something technologists can tackle by themselves and we have to have to have to look at legislative solutions alongside any technology we build

my argument isn't that foss as techology will save us but that foss as an ideology must be part of how we reform or revolutionize society or else we lose power over the most critical aspects of information and organization

@cosine yes, i agree with this and it's exactly my point - it isn't possible for FOSS to compete in this space because corporate entities have made the process of provisioning storage and compute tied to stable income, stable location, or both

for example foss could (and does) provide trivially easy access to tools once you have a server set up - see for instance sandstorm

this is similar to the "install cliff" that MS relies on to prevent people from using free desktops. no matter how much better Ubuntu is, nobody will use it because it doesn't run on lots of hardware and even for hardware it does run on you have to go through a fair amount of effort to install it

no matter how good the installer is, no matter how good sandstorm is, going through that process will never be easier than using existing corporate solutions

@rocket yes, i agree with you

@herag again: off topic for this thread, sorry. it's just an example.

@dredmorbius @ghost_bird it's really well documented incl irc receipts and other things and like, public posts that are still up

the devs are g a r b a g e

@dredmorbius @ghost_bird i'm declaring this off topic for this thread, sorry

camera | filter | strip metadata | compress | post on social media and each of those components can be swapped out by the user

branching pipelines that upload to multiple social media at once

i promise i'm not going to write another fucking novel but just. please imagine graphical unix philosophy programs for mobile phones