It's really difficult for survivors to come forward about abuse from popular artists. It's *extremely* difficult when you're a youth coming forward about an older adult who has authority, maturing, social knowledge, and can easily EASILY gaslight you and write you off as lying.

Our instinct should be to believe survivors. Period.

I've gone on and on about how I'm a 51a mandatory reporter. How I'm legally obligated to be on the lookout for child abuse.

Usually I bring this up as a way to say "don't say stuff to me you wouldn't say to your highschool unless you want me to take action"

but in this context it's to say *I've been trained in recognizing and taking action surrounding child abuse* and looking at the situation it's a fucking shame what you're all doing

The way CSA survivors behave as youth and as adults is completely in line with how the survivors coming forward are behaving. They posted this stuff in other locations *before* going to kiwifarms. There's solid evidence for a lot of the shit going around. There's no evidence that kiwifarms doctored any of it.

Kiwifarms shouldn't be having more sympathy for survivors than all of you.

I know that a lot of us are friends with one or two of the people being implicated in the call-out posts.

We shouldn't be blindly deciding it's all lies because of that.

Doxxing is bad. dont' share doxxes. But for fucks sake there are CSA survivors in the Mastodon community and if we want to be a safe community for them to we shouldn't be fucking denying it when we hear about CSA

@shel What does it mean when you say "go to Kiwisfarms?"

@b_cavello @shel its a rly bad website where ppl stalk/harass ppl for fun, esp trans ppl, but unforc if ur a csa survivor and an internet celeb abused u, its one of the only places that takes u at ur word (even if it is just to further their transphobic agenda)

@hi_cial @shel Thank you for this context.

@b_cavello @shel no worries.

I've been trained in what you do when someone comes to you and says an adult has been doing inappropriate shit to them

You start with "That's horrible"
You start with "Can I ask you some more questions? I'm going to have to report this if that's alright"

You make yourself into a trusted adult for that child.

And I know "call-out culture sucks" but this isn't fucking "Nicki Minaj called someone a stupid hoe" this is CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE

There's a huge fucking difference between "masterlist of minorly problematic shit this person said" and "This person is a known child pornographer"

Let me repeat that

There is a difference between "Your fave is problematic: Amy Poehler" and "This member of our community grooms children into creating child pornography"

A call-In of "Hey bud wanna think about that and apologize?" DOESN'T FUCKING WORK in that instance

It's cliche but THINK OF THE FUCKING CHILDREN

This is about removing social power from someone.

Now a friend of ours who got implicated in some chatlogs because of a mistake with how they handled the news? That's a mistake. That's something you can learn and apologize from

But the main incident, the prominent artists?

Stop fucking defending them there's years of evidence

like it's a seriously fucked up pattern that kiwifarms can again and again take credit for believing and advocating for CSA survivors when us SJWs cucks wouldn't and instead of saying "well they're kiwifarms they're fucks" we should take it as a fucking wake-up call to be better enough about this that people don't turn to kiwifarms for support in the first place

If someone prominent on Mastodon pulls shit like this we need to be Better

If a prominent poster on Mastodon turns out to be a pedophile it doesn't fucking matter if kiwifarms took notice too like we need to first and foremost protect The Fucking Minors On Here

You got that?

This isn't a safe place for CSA survivors if we're gonna be calling accusations of CSA "lies" because we don't like where we're hearing it from; when not that much investigating shows it's pretty fucking true

@shel and, unfortunately, even though kf harasses a ton of innocent people, they _have_ exposed quite a few child abusers with a decently high true positive rate

it's fucked up that they're doing this _for us_

"Call-out culture" isn't worse than child pornography

If someone is producing child pornography

A call-out that tells all the teens to stay away from that person

Is the most effective thing that we can do

And I'll be the first to call ppl in for most shit over call-outs

But not with fucking CSA there's no misunderstandings there you got that? I won't fucking mess around.

Also to be clear

There's a difference between a 30-year-old grooming a minor for sexual abuse purposes

And an 18-year-old not believing a survivor when they're told about this because they were naive and wanted to believe their cool older friend wasn't a pedophile

That's a mistake.
We can call out the abusers, believe the survivors, without calling out or ostracizing someone who got caught up in this by accident.

I'm done just

originally I wasn't gonna post about this on main but I couldn't fucking stay silent I've been trained too many times on this shit and had it drilled into me not to stay silent

Let's make this a community where someone feels like they have a better recourse to oust a serial abuser of children than making a deal with the devil

@shel good thread Shel! You've got some good insight. Thank you for this.

@shel w o r d

Ppl like them make an art out of manipulating & lying & obscuring

Its not someones fault that a person posing as their friend was actually dangerous. Its not your fault you trusted someone. Trust is beautiful and the core of making friends. Its those who abuse that trust who are tl blame

@shel I can’t say I fully understand what you are talking about, but do wholeheartedly agree that when it comes to CSA, even if it’s just a warning sign, silence is never ok.

@Tdorey a prominent furry artist who has been rumored to be a pedophile for years finally had it pretty much confirmed that they are; and in particular a survivor came forward about said artist's husband coercing them into agreeing to participate in creating child bestiality porn

like it sounds too horrible to be true

a couple ppl on here were friends with this artist and have gotten caught up in the scandal

@Tdorey @shel is there a non-kiwifarms place that has this stuff or if I want to know do I have to walk into hell

@sl2c @Tdorey bestofglitchedpuppet.tumblr.com has Everything in it with like minute by minute updates

@Tdorey @shel oh dang. I liked eevee, but yikes

@shel i Absolutely am hoping they come back, apologise & cut ties w the pedo. I sent them links to stuff (to show it wasnt fake screenshots) & offered support. I -want- to see them rebound. I -want- to see them get away from this group!!

@hi_cial they're a friend of mine and I haven't personally confronted them because I get the impression that's not what they want right now especially because what I saw you saying seemed pretty much as good as it'll get and me scolding them might just make them defensive

@shel i mean i know theyre feeling. Horrible rn. But knowing nobody (but kf...) is blaming them will. I rly hope. Help them to process the truth & do the right thing

Tbqh i didnt even realize they were in the post at first, i brought the link here bc of The Pokemon User... then it was like oh, shit, they think im calling -them- out...

@shel I want to say thank you for talking about this; I know some of the victims of the current group in question and it pains me that I haven't seen more people recognizing them for what they are

I've thought the same thing about kiwifarms and its disgusting that people aren't willing to look at the evidence just because of its source

Especially since one of the people in that group is a (semi-active) mastodon user, I hate that they're here