It really annoys me when people say that they are for human rights, but that they want to torture or kill their enemies... Whatever happened to having principles?

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@raspberry_boy you can't have a revolution without breaking a few ~eggs~ heads.

@raspberry_boy It's less a matter of principle and more a concrete fact. Of course I would prefer to have the least amount of violence possible, but I also recognize it as necessary, especially because whoever we are opposing will be a lot less hesitant to use violence to their defense

@luna Though I also recognise that violence is sometimes necessary, remember that people only need to defend themselves when they are being attacked. I really hope your plan isn't going around attacking people...

@raspberry_boy @luna do you consider threatening peoples lives to be violence? Is it different if its at gun point or say, by making it so if they don't work they starve and can't house themselves?

Similarly, is it violent to say "I'll punch you in the face if you smoke this joint" vs "the cops will arrest you and throw you in jail if you smoke this joint"

A revolution is self-defense, we've just been made too accustomed to the constant violence to see it as such

@dragon @luna I do agree with that.

I guess I have mixed feelings because I know *violence wrong* but also I know that *violence necessary* :c

@raspberry_boy @luna violence is wrong, but yeah it's like,, if it's not wrong to punch a guy who's trying to mug you its not wrong to gut Jeff bezos like a fish

@grainloom @raspberry_boy @luna the article seems to be kinda misrepresenting the social and historical context of the time and also idk how you expect to have a revolution without violence, like the rich aren't gonna just give up their wealth we need to take it by force

@dragon @raspberry_boy @luna if someone is fantasizing about gutting anyone then they are not fit to serve justice.

@dragon @raspberry_boy @luna well, that's the short version at least. the longer is what i remember from the linked essay. but it's been a while since i've read it.
basically, widespread uncontained violence doesn't do much good.

@grainloom @raspberry_boy @luna ah yeah okay I mean valid but also it's more a figure of speech than anything else

@dragon @raspberry_boy @luna yeah, it's that until it isn't. some people use similar jokes to test the waters. it's how we get transphobic jokes, or antisemitic jokes, and then they get mirrored in policy.
so i'm trying to be more careful with my and my friends' jokes nowadays.

@dragon @raspberry_boy to clarify, i know those are different in important ways, but they are examples people know. the problem is not that people make jokes at the expense of rich people, but that they joke about brutally murdering their enemies.
by all means knock Bezos down a few dozen pegs, just don't start a reign of terror.
tbh i don't think him dying would change much and if the social structures that protect him are no longer in place, killing him wouldn't even be needed. wouldn't object to locking him up tho.

@dragon @raspberry_boy @luna (a bit tangential, but i also found that after listening to some very nasty humor, it changed how i act in some similarly nasty ways. i know not everyone works the same way though.)

@dragon @raspberry_boy @luna without getting into specifics, i've had encounters that left me wanting to mess some people up, but acting on that has never led to anything good.

and like, i thought we agreed that retributive justice doesn't really work all that well.

some coercion is necessary for justice, but that's not the same as "let's make an example out of this person".

@grainloom @dragon @raspberry_boy please untag me from this, I don't have much interest in this conversation

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