ESR took a cool counterculture and got his shitty right-wing UNIX ideology all over it—he's not just a bad person, he's a exceptionally bad historian and you shouldn't take his word for anything, the jargon file that he "curates" reflects nothing like an actual 70s/80s programming culture.
here's a pre-ESR jargon file for reference: https://www.dourish.com/goodies/jargon.html
@bob i'm guessing >80% of everyone who is referencing the jargon file is referencing the catb.org version, which does not look like it's been updated since 2003
@bob that's cool but i have never heard anybody mention it—for most people the jargon file is a document frozen in time in 2003 that pretends to be a document frozen in time in 1980s
@bob if I was collecting a jargon file today i would probably want to start whole cloth then trying to sort through the messy baggage handed down from esr
@nightpool "The JARGON file is being updated. The guy doing so has
changed the nasty references to Unix to refer to MS-DOS
because "all the ITS partisans have now become Unix
partisans, since the Unix philosophy is the same as the
ITS philosophy." as he says."
@nightpool it's great to know that I accidentally picked up a tainted version of the jargon file as one of my first experiences with the internet. :o(
(I've favored Unix because it's the least-shit modern OS)
@nightpool seriously, the worst thing that could happen with the "neo-hacker" culture we see on the fediverse is people in technology starting to take esr seriously again after all these years of deserved obscurity
Hell, esr is probably *why* I get slight heebie jeebies from all the happy self identified "hackers" in the fediverse
@nightpool there should be a filter that replaces "esr" with "a guy who forked Carl Harris's popmail client"
Some stuff seems to be missing, or perhaps I read it somewhere else contemporaneously and mistook it for the Jargon file.
This little ditty, for one:
As I was passing Project MAC,
I met a Quux with seven hacks.
Every hack had seven bugs;
Every bug had seven manifestations;
Every manifestation had seven symptoms.
Symptoms, manifestations, bugs, and hacks,
How many losses at Project MAC?
.. and a story about several broken people in a van, late at night.
@nightpool The question is, if yours is authoritative,, maintained, and better than ESR's, how can we make it be better known?
(Of course, authoritative in hackdom is a bit weird.)
@nightpool Hm. Quote: "GAS [as in "gas chamber"] interj. 1. A term of disgust and hatred, implying that gas should be dispensed in generous quantities, thereby exterminating the source of irritation. "
Seems not so much different in shitty rightwingness.
@nightpool did something happen to prompt this? periodic reminds of ESR's bias are no bad thing, of course. I just wonder if something popcorn-worthy happened.
@nightpool still, it reflects _some_ culture, which descended from the programming culture of 70s/80s.
Also, what does his Unix ideology have to do with his libertarianism, in this context?
@nightpool well ok, but the Unix camp was there too, and had its lore, too, which is IMO equally worth preserving.
Maybe the way these two lores were combined doesn't reflect the conflict between them, but it's good to have them both.
@nightpool Revisiting MIT AI Lab jargon from 1983 is (a) a fascinating glimpse at a "more innocent age", with all the pluses and minuses that implies; and (b) a real trip, since nobody at MIT talked like that when I was there (2001--05).
@nightpool I totally agree. I can't STAND his "silence is golden" idea. Also saying he "curated" the jargon file gives him WAY too much credit. It existed for literally decades before he decided to write a book out of it.
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