Something that would really change my life as a FOSS dev is that people stop seeing FOSS as a finished product but instead as a best effort collective work by people that are [in position off] contributing for free on their free personal time on it and gave it to you for free [when this situation apply].

Like stop saying that "this is total shit" because you had bugs or because it wasn't top 100% perfect like you want for your super edge case that it wasn't designed for -_-

@bram "Free as in freedom", or more like "Free as in toilet", or "Free as in 'when volunteers have free time to work for free'"

@aleks @bram

I recently decided the free software movement is fighting the wrong battle in their war for software freedom.

The real enemy is capitalism. There are billions to be made from proprietary software. Free software is written by volunteers that have to do something else most of their time to get food and shelter, it can never compete.

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@mike @bram Yes, the question of being able to build commons in a capitalist economy is crucial.

To me the battle of free software became irrelevant considered that nowadays:
- capitalism ate free software and rebranded it as opensource, which really is just "free software with free as in free market"
- there's free software everywhere, used to build centralized proprietary services
- everything happens in the cloud, so there are many questions like "how do you effectively trust sysadmins with your data"

@mike @bram
- you can add shitty trademark policy on top of your supposedly "FOSS" which basically breaks freedom 0
- you can build FOSS that include shitty proprietary web trackers
- "if you don't like it, fork it" is not an acceptable answer
- ...

@aleks @bram

Well, this is arguing semantics but I would say the battle is relevant but it's impossible to win for the reasons you stated.

Even the GPL keeps getting ignored and worked around, like Android devices with proprietary firmware and companies like VMWare breaking the license and getting away with it.

@aleks @bram @mike The problem was that they continued focusing on software for far too long and failed to consider other aspects of computing, people's data in particular. It was also at its core a pretty selfish movement: it was about whether Richard Stallman could use his printer, not about whether some random person off the street could do what they wanted. The target was always people who already knew how to code and use a command line. So the users gravitated toward the fake free stuff.

@mike @bram @aleks The most impactful thing we could possibly do, by far, is to teach children how computers work. People who grow up knowing what a computer can do, and what can go wrong with letting someone else do it for you, won't be satisfied with having computing be a black box.

@freakazoid @aleks @bram

Three of my four children just don't care and the fourth understands the situation but doesn't care enough to do anything.

If I can't even raise people that care about software freedom, it's a hard battle to fight.

@mike @bram @aleks I didn't say teach them about software freedom. I said teach them how computers work.

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